MY FUCKING FANDOM GIVES ME FUCKING FITS, part 34,849

[hth]

Warning: the following is not nice. It is not just, it is not kind, it is not respectful, and it may not even be sane. I may regret it in the morning, I don't know.



In clicking randomly through lj links this evening, I ran across a post-ep entry from somebody whose name I know from SGA fandom -- I specify that because I want to say she's not someone I have some kind of pre-existing grudge toward; I really only recognize the name and know nothing about her, really (I'm even only assuming it's a "her," out of statistical likelihood). And even though I've been frothing at the mouth for an hour now, I'm not trying to put her in particular on the spot for Fandom Crimes writ large, which is the reason I'm not naming her or being super-specific; I suppose she'd recognize herself, and maybe some other people would, too, but mainly I'm hoping it's anonymous enough to let me vent without putting her in an embarrassing position.

That said.

There was a person, right, a relatively prolific writer of and about Sheppard/McKay, and she'd seen an episode, and the episode contained some pretty obscure potential subtext between two characters that she particularly dislikes as a pairing -- enough that she felt it might give people an excuse to write fic about this pairing. And to paraphrase, she basically said, Oh, God, I hate CharacterZ/CharacterQ, and lately everyone seems to love them, and this will only get those other fans all excited. Maybe I'll just unsubscribe from sga_noticeboard until I don't have to worry about seeing all those CharacterZ/CharacterQ stories floating around.

And I don't exactly know where to begin, but I just -- I continue to be so fucking appalled at the outrageously self-centered, entitled, black-hole-of-need wing of McShep fandom. YOU MOTHERFUCKERS ALREADY OWN EVERYTHING. You are everywhere. Your pairing is everywhere. Are we even *on* the same sga_noticeboard? People are writing you literally a dozen or more stories PER DAY, all about your darling lovelies. YOU HAVE FUCKING WON, ALL RIGHT? Now get off our fucking backs!

I don't know if there will be a mad upsurge in Z/Q fic, but I'm pretty sure that if so, "mad upsurge"=maybe five or six stories MAX, TOTAL written by X/Q fans in response to Episode T. But your VIRGIN FUCKING EYEBALLS aren't capable of doing what we plebes do every day of our lives and PAGING DOWN your flist, past the links to the stories you don't want to read? You're too goddamn good for that? The mere knowledge that other people are out there writing their crazy Other Pairings is so upsetting for you that you have to go lie down with a cold compress until it's over?

Well, lucky fucking you -- because it will be over. If I want to unsub and come back when everybody's writing what I want and not writing what I don't want, I'll be gone for a factor of FOREVER.

And you know what? I do truly think that's what a lot of people want. I think there's a stratum of this fandom that would like people like me to just go away, because all we're doing is breathing the oxygen of the McKay/Sheppard people. And it's not just that they don't like our pairings and they don't care what we do -- I've never read a Lorne/Parrish story in my life, because I don't care and I don't want to; I'm not saying everyone needs to be a fan of everything. It goes way past that. It's not "well, whatever you want, I'll be over here doing my thing," it's this attitude like we are an actual drag to have co-existing within the same fandom. You have to UNSUB? SERIOUSLY? So you don't accidentally read our HEADERS?

I've been doing this fandom thing for many years now (10 years! Jesus Christ!), and I feel like I've had a really successful fangirl career. I'm not the best writer in the fandom; I'm probably not even the tenth best writer in the fandom, but those other ten girls are so fucking AWESOME that they deserve their spots in the sun, and in most cases I'm, no shit, the biggest fan they have. But I'm proud of what I write, and I get some of the best feedback on the planet -- I'm consistently amazed at the time and the attention that my little cadre of readers invests, time and again, in what I write. I'm happy being the kind of writer I am -- I mean, if I weren't, it's not like I'm too stupid to figure out what kind of thing I should be writing to get more attention. If I needed universal validation, I wouldn't have spent the last month of my life writing a giant fucking het epic with an OFC; the story before that I wouldn't have shot John; I'd do a lot of things differently, if being in the mainstream of SGA fandom was my big goal. I love what I do and I wouldn't change it for the world, and I've never been less than humbled and amazed by the attention I do get. This is to say: I'm not on this Earth to win over the McShep brigade, and they could ignore me until the end of time and it really wouldn't phase me at all.

What leaves me shocked and hurt and angry isn't that there's a large segment of the fandom that doesn't care for/about what I do. It's that I genuinely feel like they want us gone -- like they feel that SGA fandom and all its associated pan-fandom space (like noticeboard, for example) is and should be and deserves to be the property of its largest contingent -- as if the fandom should be majority-rules and that those of us who are hanging around loving the fuck out of X/Q or A/C or O/P or whatever it is we're passionate about are basically in the way. We're a nuisance that they have no choice but to wait out, hoping that soon the fandom can go back to what they basically think it is anyway: the glee club for the John and Rodney Show.

And, you know, a huge part of me wants to do exactly that. The constant, steady, relentless drumbeat of OMG DON'T YOU JUST LOVE EVERYTHING ABOUT THEM ALL THE TIME?!!?11! is wearing enough as it is -- and I'm not even anti- the pairing. It's just like somebody trying to get you to eat strawberry shortcake seven times a day, every day of your life. Strawberry shortcake is *fine,* it's nice, I like it perfectly well, right up until the day when you hit that wall and all you can think is JESUS, SHUT THE FUCK UP, I'LL HURL ALL OVER THE FLOOR IF I SEE ONE MORE STRAWBERRY FUCKING SHORTCAKE. And that's sad, because it's a nice dessert, and McKay/Sheppard is a nice pairing (I have at least ten or twelve stories within it saved in my permanent collection of Bulletproof Fic that I read every time I need my comfort fix). Even if I had the power, I wouldn't want to stop people from digging on their favorite thing and I don't want to make them feel guilty for doing so, which is why I put 99% of the burden on myself. I avoid the places I know I can expect the especially shrill and piercing variety of squee that I know rubs me the wrong way. I choose what I click and don't click on. I tailor my Fandom Experience so that I stay as much as possible out of the situations that I know will set me off (obviously, I'm not successful every single day). And on the days when all of that feels impossible, like an umbrella in a hurricane, yeah, I consider severing my ties with this fandom.

But, you know, there's a lot that I'd miss, too. And I kind of like being the Loyal Opposition -- I think we're worth something, me and the rest of the fans who love our X/Q and our O/P and our other pairings that y'all think are weird and boring and squicky and totally violate the perfect purity of Rodney & John's eternal bliss. And basically, if we can slog along, hoping for our little moments, hoping this'll be the one day this week when one of our own will pop up with a story in our beloved pairing, patiently hitting our scroll button over and over and knowing that the charge we get will be even better for having had to wait for it and discover it -- then you can surely endure to have us around. And any suggestion that you can't endure it, or that you have to run and flee and hide from reminders that we exist -- well, that's just being a bad fucking winner.

There's such a thing as Carson fans in this fandom. There's such a thing as Teyla fans. There's such a thing as Elizabeth fans in this fandom. PLEASE BELIEVE ME WHEN I SAY, WE HAVE ALL HAD A HARD YEAR OF IT. We've taken hit after hit, only to have people who write stories that suggest that John and Rodney live alone on a space station somewhere tell us that we're big whiners and anything short of being totally stoked about s4 is childish and unfair. If you can't possibly find it within yourself to be sympathetic allies, even though your guys still are and always will be the leads and you don't have to worry that you'll ever be in our position -- if you can't be our friends in this, please at least refrain from acting as if you resent the pieces of the fandom we've carved out for ourselves, and most of all refrain from suggesting that public SGA fandom space isn't large enough for all of us at once. Because we all know that you're not going anywhere. Nor should you have to.

Nor should we.

Comments

[viciouswishes.livejournal.com]

The strawberry shortcake analogy hits it on the head. Brilliant. I'm going to steal that and use it next time I have to have a conversation about someone about how I'm sick of something that I do enjoy on occasion and am not a h8ter of.

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

I fall back on a lot of analogies, because it's really hard to stake out a coherent position on things like this, you know? It falls so quickly into, as one person put it, "my ship vs. your ship," when, God, I don't *want* it to be that. In my head, it's not that. I don't even *have* a ship -- or rather, I have lots of them that I like and read and write, including McShep. I don't consider myself a "shipper" in that pairing, though, in that I don't identify myself or describe my fandom participation through it -- or any other ship. I like a lot of stuff. I want the space to be available for a lot of stuff -- including the yummy and delicious strawberry shortcake.

But *sigh.* Why am I explaining this to you? You see what I'm trying for perfectly well!

We're not all self-centred, I swear.

[elaran.livejournal.com]

I'm one of the strawberry shortcake [ok, I kinda don't like it at all but I'm working with the analogy here] worshippers but I'm not so much with the forcing it down everyone else's throats. If I'd read that [McShep fangirl or not] I'd still be pretty fucking pissed. That kinda reasoning makes me want to whack that person's head against a wall.

That said, I would also tend to think [after I'd finished headdesking at their stupidity] what harriet_spy thought.

Re: We're not all self-centred, I swear.

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

I said originally that I might regret this post in the morning -- and I don't think I do, I mean, at least not all of it -- but I *very much* regret that the way I approached it gave some people the impression that they have to tell me not all McShep shippers are self-centered. I know! I really do know! I like lots of them, and there are many more that I don't really know, like you, but I have no earthly reason to believe they're not totally cool and wonderful.

I'm angry and a wee bit irrational, but I'm not *so* irrational that I would ever suggest that such a large group of people was collectively and completely No Damn Good. That would be, not irrational, what's the word? Right, INSANE. *g*

[castalianspring.livejournal.com]

Here from metafandom, mostly to agree with your post entirely. That kind of entitlement attitude infuriates me, especially when there's no corner of SGA fandom where you can get away from Shep/McKay. I participated in the fandom when the show first aired, when that pairing was in the minority, but it's become such a chore to avoid this kind of wanky behaviour that I'm pretty much done with it.

Carson fan here, and yeah, hard year for that portion of the fandom. Disappointing enough to watch what's aired, but then for the first reaction of half my flist to be along the lines of "how dare they say Rodney and Carson were best friend?! That hurts my 'ship, so I say that's rubbish and shouldn't be canon" - I had to sit on my hands and just walk away from the computer that day. At first I was neutral about the McShep thing, but the way its fandom behaves, it's moved on to an outright loathing. And not just of the stupid portmanteau.

[mice1900.livejournal.com]

You are so singing to the choir where I'm concerned.

[blucola.livejournal.com]

SGA is the first fandom in which I literally prefer team fic to the main accepted pairing. Mind you, I read a lot of McShep, but I love all the other characters to pieces. I find myself missing them (sometimes, it really does depend) if a story is completely Rodney/John centric. I'm a romance hound and I'm still new to SGA (became a fan in 2007, no less!) and perhaps that makes me more open to other pairings?

The attitude you're talking about is not a new one to me. I've experienced it many times in the TPM fandom. And in Due South (OMG, which Ray!?!!) I wish folks would remember to be polite and that there's plenty of smutty fun to go around and to not trample on other folks fun. Seriously, is that so hard?

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

Oh, God, the Ray Wars! Jiminy, that takes me back. The harsh thing was, that was a situation where it really was a matter of which *one* pairing would be visible -- literally, canonically visible on your tv screen. It's awful to see the same kind of competitive bitterness in a show with an ensemble cast, where we really all *could* enjoy our pairings of choice simultaneously.

[vagablonde.livejournal.com]

Maybe the most beautiful thing I've ever read...

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

Well, if I had it to do over again, I'd use fewer "fucks" *g* But thank you anyway.

You have every right to vent.

[mz-bstone.livejournal.com]

Just as that other fan did. She might feel that a lot of her favourites have migrated to other fandoms, or other pairings, or it might be the pairing itself that hits some tic she's got. So she gripes about it in her LJ. And it hits a nerve, makes you feel like you're unwelcome. And you respond:

And I don't exactly know where to begin, but I just -- I continue to be so fucking appalled at the outrageously self-centered, entitled, black-hole-of-need wing of McShep fandom. YOU MOTHERFUCKERS ALREADY OWN EVERYTHING. You are everywhere. Your pairing is everywhere. Are we even *on* the same sga_noticeboard? People are writing you literally a dozen or more stories PER DAY, all about your darling lovelies. YOU HAVE FUCKING WON, ALL RIGHT? Now get off our fucking backs!

Which is, in it's way, as upsetting to me as her post was to you. You express what troubles you, what bothers you. Intellectually I appreciate that. And I don't deny that McShep has a huge presence in the fandom. I know that it's frustrating when you can't find things that answer your tastes. I've been in fandoms like that. So you vent, and it's perfectly reasonable to do so.

However, as a fan who likes McShep but is perfectly happy to have an abundance of other stuff, when people post what you post -- and it happens more than you might realize, since you have the feeling that you're tastes are unwelcome, so you see those posts and think, hey, someone agrees with me -- I feel rather hunted and unwelcome, if you can see that, because I see several of them, and often they don't even throw in the word "wing".

I think the majority of McShep fans, based on off-LJ coversations I have, are probably in my school of "hey, whatever!". We don't comment one way or the other about other pairings because we don't care. Shake your own groove-thing, bake your own beautiful cake, whatever works. It's just that the people who are more ... missionary (hrm. my brain went to the bad place.) in their fannish zeal say stuff, while those who don't care, nod, shrug, think: pull a seat up, have fun and then we move on back to doing our own thing. If you're neutral, you tend to not comment one way or the other because it's not a big deal when alternate pairing orientations are represented. We're just enjoying what we enjoy, and more power to you.

So saying things like "self-centred" and "motherfuckers" and "get off our back", while totally within your rights to vent in your space? Are just as unwelcoming and fracturing as what the first fan said. Hell, when I was writing more, I made some effort to be more than just McShep, because it's a good show and I liked to play in the puddles and I wanted to give to others, as well. Mostly? I try to be a good neighbour, and while you maybe don't mean me, it doesn't come across that way.

You have every right to vent. I just wish I didn't feel bad about liking what I like after, you know? I wish the words you used didn't leave me feeling ... not offended, I guess. Slapped, maybe.


B

Re: You have every right to vent.

[astolat]

What she said.

[ingrid-m.livejournal.com]

From metafandom

Hilarious rant! And very applicable to anyone who doesn't ship the almighty OTP of any fandom. In mine, BSG, if you aren't a Lee/Kara fan, you might as well go soak your head and the fandom is teeny-tiny to begin with, so you can imagine the insular (and seething) nature of the entitlement!

It's a cold, irritating, tiresome world when your inclinations don't follow the masses, no matter the fandom, or whether it be slash, het or gen. (Although I've discovered the hard way that turning away from slash after 10 years and developing a het inclination leads to a whole 'nuther set of WTF, YOU ALREADY OWN ALL OF EVERY FANDOM!)

But, I wouldn't trade my inclinations -- past or current -- for anything. I'm too old and crusty to join a herd; better I stand over here and shave my horns on a rock like the old ram I am and hope the spring ewes will find me ... someday. ;)

[starry-diadem.livejournal.com]

BSG, if you aren't a Lee/Kara fan, you might as well go soak your head and the fandom is teeny-tiny to begin with

Heh. My sympathies--I know how that feels. I write mainly in the original BSG. And believe me, that's really teeny-tiny.

[angiepen.livejournal.com]

[Here from metafandom. [wave]]

Oh, good grief. :/ This isn't even my fandom and I'm eyerolling at the attitude. If that's any kind of an accurate report of what was said, then it's that person you're sort of quoting who should feel ashamed, seriously.

I've never gotten people like that. We have them in my main fandom too (LOTRiPS) and I don't get them there either. There's a major divide in LOTRiPS between people who think the guys who played the Hobbits are just to die for, and people who think the men and elves are more perv-worthy, and then there are pairing groupings within each larger group, but I've never understood the attitude of exclusion. I mean, it's one thing to start a community for your favorite pairing or your favorite character, but if you're hanging out at a place which is for the entire fandom then the entire fandom is going to be there and making snarky comments about this or that character or pairing or fan-group, pretending you have to scrub your eyes out with bleach just because you saw a Hobbit-fic header scroll by, is just selfish and ignorant and makes the poster look like a twelve-year-old bitch. There are certainly characters I don't care for and pairings which include one or more of those characters I'd have to be persuaded to read (and the persuasion probably wouldn't work anyway), but I can't imagine doing the "Ewww!" thing whenever such a character or pairing is mentioned, mostly because it's immature but also because it's damn rude to other fans.

I keep hoping fandom as a whole will grow up a bit but I don't think it's going to happen in my time. [sigh]

Angie

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

As someone who has to deal with the "EWWW! GROSS!" reaction in regard to my actual sexuality, it's sort of blindingly obnoxious to come into my crazy, kinky, queer, slutty little fandom universe and hear it all over again about yet another set of things that turn me on. But, you know. That's what you deal with sometimes, I guess.

[wesleysgirl.livejournal.com]

Thanks for writing this.

I'm a McShep fan first and foremost, but like lots of other people who commented here, I'm a big fan of other pairings as well. And I've never understood why some people "hate" X pairing -- like, what, there aren't enough actually shitty things to hate in the world, they've got to get their panties in a twist about something as innocuous as a pairing in a SciFi fandom? Sheesh. If people are happy about a pairing, I'm happy FOR them, whether the pairing is interesting to me or not.

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

Yeah, it's slightly alien logic to me. "I hate this pairing!" What, it killed your mom? It cut you off in traffic? It ruined your day how, exactly?

But I think - speculation is always dangerous - but I think a lot of people feel that their judgment is being questioned whenever people have a different perspective. So if I think, I don't know, Radek and Novak are destined to be together, and I can see the love shining from their eyes every time they're on screen, but that person over there is going, no, the thing I see is all about how MFEO Radek and Heightmeyer are...then what, is that person calling me stupid? They're saying they're right and I'm wrong?

It's a kind of zero-sum thinking: one of us has to be watching it right, and one of us is watching it wrong. And I think that means that some people, when they *really* don't see a pairing and *really* aren't into it, just assume that people who are into it are secretly looking down on them and calling them wrong and stupid. Which...maybe they are, but probably not.

Or I'm totally wrong about all of that? I don't know, it's a question that's always interested me, and always stumps me. What's the point at which someone else's pairing crosses the line from "not my thing" into "offensive by its mere existence"? I have theories galore, and no actual wisdom to share whatsoever.

[eleveninches.livejournal.com]

Um, is this about my "Sunday" post?

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

I'd prefer not to say anything publically about whose post it was, but I have e-mailed the original poster privately.

now this...

[delux-vivens.livejournal.com]

There's such a thing as Carson fans in this fandom. There's such a thing as Teyla fans. There's such a thing as Elizabeth fans in this fandom.

is just crazy talk! next you'll be saying that there are people who read and write teyla/elizabeth!!!!!

Re: You have every right to vent.

[trialia]

Funny. ^_~ Actually, I prefer Elizabeth/Laura, if we're talkin'. *cough*

[mf_luder_xf]

I fully support this post. While I almost always seem to end up in the majority pairing of my fandoms (which at times makes me feel like sell-out), I would never not accept other pairings--if I don't like it, I don't read it. As you point out, that's exactly what headers are for.

I can't imagine why any one wants another pairings out of a fandom, though. I certainly have nothing against any pairing. I myself have no ground to blame or say 'ew' to any pairing considering my Supernatural and Heroes pairings. However, I can say I know (to a perhaps, smaller degree) what you mean about people seeming to not want a pairing in the fandom. The fight between SPN het and SPN Wincesters was fierce for some time (it's died down or at least I've gotten better at ignoring it) and I couldn't understand why the two sides were so bitter. I like both. I'm also a relativist when it comes to fandom. I mean, it's fandom, not life or death--why should it matter who likes what? Can't we all just get along?

Ok, so after my own mini rant...*facepalm* Let's just say I fully support yours, even being a (default) McShepper.

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

Don't feel like a sell-out! Popular pairings are popular for a reason, and contrary to what some might say, that reason is not Evil Fandom Voodoo Dolls. Those pairings speak to a lot of people in some way, and anything that speaks to you is *for* you.

The incest fandoms are their own whole special thing. I mean, I personally support the incest fic (never written it myself, but I've always wanted to try my hand at Firefly Tamcest), but I can also see why there are some people who feel profoundly uncomfortable with the very fact that it's out there in such great numbers. I mean, I think they're wrong about the meaning and the effects of it, but I see where they're coming from. For them it's a moral issue. In SGA fandom, it's so often an issue of taste elevated and treated as if it were a moral issue.

[paraka]

I just wanted to say, that I really have to agree with all that you've said. I always find it baffling when people get into ship wars, but wanting the others to go *away*? That's just wrong.

I'll admit, most of the fic I read is McShep. Why? Because there's so friggin' much of it. Left on my own though, it's not my OTP or anything. I can think of at least 3 other SGA pairings that I'd *rather* read. And god, if you're (person you were referring to, not you) *so* annoyed about having to see and/or acknowledge that the whole fandom doesn't breath your pairing, then yeah, you probably should unsubscribe. There are a ton of other communities out there that only have McShep, go look at those. *rolls eyes*

There's such a thing as Carson fans in this fandom. There's such a thing as Teyla fans. There's such a thing as Elizabeth fans in this fandom. PLEASE BELIEVE ME WHEN I SAY, WE HAVE ALL HAD A HARD YEAR OF IT.
Yes! Please, so you don't care for a particular character, fine whatever. But I find it a bit hurtful when I read people on my flist mocking the work that fans have been doing trying to save their characters. Come on, the show is already 80% John/Rodney, can we please at least keep that 20%? Gah.

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

That's what makes this so much more painful for me than just another my ship vs. your ship squabble. I feel like we're all subsisting on crumbs from *canon* anyway, except Sheppard fans and McKay fans, and then it seems like when we show signs of wanting more than crumbs from fandom, there are people who go nuts. It is very small and dark in this attic! We would like to be able to run around the yard sometimes, too! *g*

Re: May I suggest....getting a life?

[trialia]

...Where's irony_rocks??

Also, being lesbian doesn't automatically exempt you from 'shipping m/m pairings, y'know. *g*

Do I rant about how prolific that 'ship is? How I can't get away from it no matter how much I try and how other pairings should get equal time in newsletters no matter how much of each pairing's fic or meta is posted? No. I had one tl;dr moment over sga_newsletter some time ago, and since then I've grown up and calmed down. I don't make an issue of it anymore. But the sheer entitlement issues inherent in the post to which the OP here is referring... oh, that all just makes me So. Damn. Angry.

[mice1900.livejournal.com]

*kisses you passionately*

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

Hey, that tickles! *g*

And I'm sure it's politically unwise to admit this right now, but...I kind of adore your icon. Dude, his FACE! Hee.

[uselessplayback.livejournal.com]

I like McKay/Sheppard but I also like a slew of other pairings. Team fic! A friend of mine recently came into SGA fandom as a reader and she's not a slash fan but somehow we have managed to trade links for pairings that neither of us would normally read in peace. So, while I get that sometimes a pairing will be out of your comfort zone, unsubscribing from a community post seems an extreme way to deal with it. I really don't get how just the mention of a pairing will send someone fleeing to another country to avoid it. For me, that's just no fun.

That said, I really prefer reading stories where the characters don't exist in a bubble of shippiness, but then, I also like death fic, so maybe I'm in a really weird group altogether.

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

The weird groups are what make a fandom the most exciting! Heck, I consider myself a John/Teyla fan, and I've written one story where they get married, one where she comes to blame him for the destruction of her galaxy and leaves him, and one where she shoots him. Clearly I express my love differently than other people do *g*

I love that fandom is the place where we all get to be weird in our own fucked-up way.

[dark-cygnet.livejournal.com]

Thank you so much for posting this. I've seen it, heard it and been zinged by it, because lord help someone who ships Carson/Rodney and John/Elizabeth. *GASP* Which is why i lurk quite a bit. You've hit the nail on the head with the biggest issue i have with this fandom. I just wish the militant ones who do this could see that fandom is big enough for all of us and even if you don't like a pairing, hey, at least respect their right to like what they like. Also, thank you for writing such wonderful stories with other character pairings. I appreciate them so much. Take care! *goes back to lurk mode*

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

Thanks! It's always kind of darkly amusing to me when the McShep shippers are like, "clearly you're just making things up; I never see anything like this," when everyone who does ship another pairing has their war stories about it. I mean, we're surely not all suffering some kind of mass delusion, are we? I get that some people love to play the martyr and blow way out of proportion how OMG OPPRESSED they are -- and maybe there's some of that going on; I don't deny that it probably feels bigger *in my brain* than it is in objective reality. But I'm pretty sure we're not making it *all* up.

[darkrosetiger.livejournal.com]

I'm pretty new to this fandom. I knew from my flist that the big pairing was McKay/Sheppard. And when I started watching the show, I could see it. I read a lot of fic that first month, and most of it was John/Rodney. I like John/Rodney.

But I also like Ronon/Rodney, and Teyla/Rodney, and Ronon/Zelenka, and John/Ronon, and Elizabeth/Caldwell, and I think there's a shameful lack of Teyla/Zelenka in this fandom. I like threesomes; I'm fond of Teyla/Ronon/Rodney enzyme fic, and my OTP in this fandom is the Team SGA-1 OT4.

I'm not one of those people who thinks that the McKay/Sheppard shippers are The Man, keeping the rest of the pairings down. But at the same time, I don't get and am frequently annoyed by the hardcore OTP McKay/Sheppard shippers who seem to feel that even the mention of another pairing in a fic that's in the McKay/Sheppard section of the newsletter will somehow harsh their fannish buzz. When people are complaining about having to see a mention of another pairing in a header...that's fannish entitlement gone way, way, too far.

And for the record, I have four bulletproof fics in this fandom, one of which is "In the Hands of Yes".

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

yeah, I try not to fall into that trap where The Man is keeping us down. I mean, not only is McShep not The Man, but we're not even really being kept down all that effectively. People *do* write other things. We manage. I think some of the climate of fandom makes it a little tougher; I'm so unbelievably lucky, because I've been so well-treated in many fandoms before this that I essentially have the ego to go, "Well, fuck it, my story is going to be awesome no matter what!" But you know, writing a story can be really hard work, and if you don't have a Name and you don't have a cadre of really loyal fans like I have, I can totally see why you might think, well, why put a month of my life into this Sheppard/Beckett if maybe nobody will even want to read it, and it'll probably get three comments like the last Sheppard/Beckett story I saw did."

I have the luxury of being able to write what I jolly well please and knowing that it'll get read, and that people will say nice things about it -- sometimes out of practically nowhere, like you just did! That's going to happen for me, and I know it; it's part of the BNF Benefits Package. *g* I write what the fuck I want and I don't worry about it. I think that's not the case for everyone, and I hate the thought that other people feel like what they're tempted to try their hand at could be received as irrelevant at best and gross and offensive at worst. That sucks so hard; I think any fandom should encourage its writers to take wacky risks, any way they can.

[beanie-j.livejournal.com]

I'm glad you wrote this because I've read a slew of posts in my journal over the past few months from friends who are not!McSheppers who are pissed off with comments that make them feel unwelcome in SGA fandom.

This fandom is dominated by three pairings - McShep being the first, and the remaining two being John/Elizabeth and John/Teyla respectively. I really had hoped that given the het-shipper wars with the latter two, the slash arm of the fandom would know better. Obviously not.

The thing is, I don't actually mind McShep - it's just not my pairing of choice. It's something I read in the absence of fic of my preferred pairings. Most of the McSheppers in my FList are decent folk who just enjoy their section of fandom and don't feel the need to wank on the people who enjoy something else. It's a shame that the vast majority of decent folk are shouted over by a small number of wankers - but then that is SGA fandom community all over - why should the McShep issue be any different???

The thing is, it isn't helped by challenge communities that are exclusion zones to anything other than the darling pairings. While I accept people have a right to read and write whatever they want, and run a community as they see fit, that sort of shit is bound to get the rest of fandom's back up. Whether that is the intent or not, people basically feel like they are being shoved to the side and that is something that people need to be more mindful of.

I love how people in this fandom go on about entitlement. Yes, entitlement is a right when it comes to writing in your own journal, however it is no excuse for rudeness. Writing in your own journal and addressing the fandom at large to me removes a certain amount of said entitlement. You are opening the door to comment and some of that may be negative. If you word your post in such a manner that it ignites the fandom you should expect the fallout and have no justification for moaning and bitching after the fact.

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

It's such a problem right now, with so many people on both "sides" (I resent that there's such a strong perception that there are "sides," with that with-us-or-against-us undertone, but that's where a lot of people are right now emotionally) frustrated and resentful. I'm not sure me ranting is helpful. I don't know what would be helpful. More aimless sniping back and forth? Not working so far. A detailed, in-depth, profound, complex discussion? Maybe, but it's hard to whip a bunch of frustrated and resentful people into one of those; I saw a lot of people try to do it when the subject was race in fandom, and I'm not sure that was a crashing success, either.

I just don't know. Maybe wait for the fandom life-cycle to turn and for things to move on. That always seems to work, but man it can be uncomfortable in the meantime.

[danamaree.livejournal.com]

In some fandoms your pairing of choice is popular, in other fandoms, your pairings isn't.

It's just the way things are. How people deal with that situation, whether they support that pairing, or not, is up to them and not indicative of every single person in fandom.

And although emotionally, I can understand those feelings, it really is unrealistic.

[veracity]

You know, your sanity is a most welcome item in all this. Wanna cookie?

Oh, squeak squeak.

[rachel-martin64.livejournal.com]

Good for you, man.

X-Men fandom went through that after X1. The fandom was eaten alive by Logan/Rogue fans.

[hth-the-first.livejournal.com]

It's really hard, I think, for people who haven't seen a fandom crumble in on itself to realize how totally possible it is for that to happen, simply based on how fans feel treated by other fans. It's like car accidents when you're sixteen -- you never believe it could happen to you, regardless of how much like a maniac you drive! *g*

I'd really rather there not be a meltdown like that in SGA, but I guess only time will tell.

[iamtheenemy.livejournal.com]

I don't know. On the list of ways you could deal with not enjoying a certain pairing, making a frustrated post in your journal and then quietly unsubscribing to a community that makes posts you're not interested in sounds like one of the classiest to me.

She didn't flame anyone, didn't namecall, didn't deny anyone the right to create z/q stories, didn't make obnoxious posts to our friended communities that flooded our flists, didn't create an anti-z/q community...

Does being a McKay/Sheppard shipper mean you forfeit the right to be annoyed by other pairings, without (from what I can see from your brief snippet) character or fellow fan bashing, and in your own journal?

[harriet-spy.livejournal.com]

Does being a McKay/Sheppard shipper mean you forfeit the right to be annoyed by other pairings,

I guess I'm kind of stuck on why you need to be "annoyed by a pairing" at all. I get not seeing a pairing. I get thinking that the pairing is bad for one/both of the characters. I get thinking that the pairing as written in canon sends really bad messages (I've been there). I even get not caring for a predominant style or interpretation of the characters in stories featuring a pairing. But annoyed by the simple fact that other people see and enjoy and write a particular pairing? How exactly does that hurt you? How is other people's enjoyment inherently something you can't stand? Is it really that threatening that ten percent of the fandom doesn't agree with you completely?

Personally, if I was so unable to deal with other people liking something I don't that I found it unbearable to see--amid many things I *am* interested in--just the *announcement* that the thing I doesn't like happens to *exist*....well, I'd keep it to myself, because I wouldn't want to embarrass myself by admitting how greedy and intolerant I am. There's nothing remotely classy about telling the world that having to confront the fact that some minority of people like something you don't is just too, too much for you.

[scififreak.livejournal.com]

I agree with a lot of what you've said here. And I'm a total McShep person. However, I enjoy a lot of other pairings in this fandom and unfortunately for me, most of them are really unpopular or rarely written in the fandom. For example, I'll read nearly any John/Carson or Teyla/Elizabeth (oh, the pain this has caused me) because of how rare the fic is for those pairings. Not to mention the fact that Carson and Elizabeth aren't the most beloved characters in the fandom, so I have had to endure a lot of character bashing and callousness towards two characters I love ("Sunday" just about killed me and it was so hard to see that most of the fans-aside from the other hardcore Carson fans-didn't even care or feel bad).

I am really thankful that my main ship is THE ship in the fandom because I know that if I was solely a Carson/John or Teyla/Elizabeth shipper, I'd be pretty lonely. And I feel no smug entitlement about that, only relief, because in nearly all my other fandoms, I've been on the other side of the pairing tracks, so to speak. I'm the Scott/Ororo, Ron/Harry, Mulder/Krycek shipper that you thought was insane for not seeing the pure and amazing love of Scott/Jean, Ron/Hermione, Mulder/Scully etc. And the smug superiority some fans have like "Well, *my* ship is CANON. Beat that" kills me. Can't we all just ship-along?

So, rambling aside, my point is to say that I feel your pain and understand your frustration with certain factions of SGA fen.

[quiet-fractures.livejournal.com]

Your post wins at life.

Good Post

[kaziwren.livejournal.com]

When I started writing on LJ in January (this year) I had a feeling my choice of pairings and character-centric pieces would likely make my stories, well, unpopular.

I write Ronon-centric or Carson-centric stories. I've written Ronon/Carson, and have plans for several pairings that I just don't see a lot of, namely Ronon/John, Carson/John, Carson/Rodney, Ronon/Radek, and a few with Lorne, Caldwell, and Teyla in the mix. I also enjoy doing team fics.

I do this because I enjoy those stories. The risks other writers take writing them I see as expanding the fandom. I'm not anti-McShep, but it's so common that I know that pairing will never find itself struggling to locate stories for years to come.

For me, and perhaps the other strange souls who have left comments on my stories (thank you, luvs), it's a constant mad search of multiple locations: FanFiction.net, Wraithbait, and not to mention all the various prompt table communities that pop up. It's frustrating.

For example, the first non-LJ site I chose to post stories was Wraithbait. I searched their drop-down and didn't see Beckett/Dex or Dex/Beckett. My only choice was to search through Beckett/Other or Dex/Other. *sigh* I don't expect every site to include that pairing as an option, but a large archive like Wraithbait? Surely we could get it there.

Seeking stories on Sheppard/Lorne or Dex/Sheppard? Good luck. Want a dose of Carson/Ronon or Radek/John? Best wishes. There are other pairings, slash and het, that I'd be interested in exploring, but tracking those stories down is like trying to find an honest politician.

So, I write my own. I write for myself, and the very tiny contingent of people on my flist who seem to enjoy my stories. I'm still finding my way in fan fiction, and I believe my writing style will improve. I just don't expect many people to give a damn.

I enjoyed your post because it was honest, and had elements that I agree with. It's just sad you had to write it.

Be well,
Kazi

Wraithbait

[alyse]

I'm not going to touch the original argument with a barge pole, but I do want to point out that Wraithbait's rules make it perfectly clear that we are willing to add additional categories once enough stories have been submitted to justify it (and providing at least one of the characters has made it onto our character list).

That's usually around 10, which I don't think is an unreasonable cut-off on a site with over 5,000 stories.

When we set up the site originally, we tried to cater for every possible combination that we could think of, some of which have very few stories because as it turned out, no one ended up writing them or if they did, they didn't submit them to us.

We're perfectly happy to archive anything related to SG:A that meets our rules. In fact, in the three years we've been running the site, I believe we've only had one group of fen contact us about a new category (Lorne/Parrish fen). All of the others have been added when we've realised we've had a few stories of that pairing. I'm not saying we spot them all as soon as they hit a magical number, but we do try and keep an eye on it, and we're always open to suggestions for new categories being mailed to us.